| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
Roy 
Guest
Joined: March 22 2009
Location: Cache Valley
Status: Offline
Points: 442
|
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote  Reply
 Posted: November 14 2009 at 10:53pm |
|
bfessler that is a beautiful tank!
|
|
90 gal Corner with / 200 gal sump.
|
 |
vadryn
Guest
Joined: February 05 2007
Location: North Logan
Status: Offline
Points: 771
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 15 2009 at 10:12am |
Somone asked for Pics - so these are current as of yesterday (Nov 14)
|
|
dew2loud1
Guest
Joined: September 20 2007
Location: cedar city
Status: Offline
Points: 999
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 15 2009 at 10:20am |
|
I think a lot of the success is due to having a deep sand bed, IMO they are ticking time bombs. They do an amazing job at handling a lot of waste and provide tons of anaerobic filtration but eventually like any septic system they fill up. I've seen it take years, but you're one big stir of the sand bed away from a ton of sulfide gas release.
But i like bare bottom tanks so i'm crazy anyway
|
|
Jeffs_little_ocean
Guest
Joined: October 04 2009
Location: Kaysville
Status: Offline
Points: 869
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 15 2009 at 10:35am |
The xenia, kenya, leathers, and shrooms look like they're in heaven. Bring on the grime lol. Obviously SPS wouldnt like being in there, but if youre going to make the 225 mostly a FOWLR tank, you should be fine. If you added a skimmer, it would probably clean up the red and brown algae films on the back and sandbed. Nice tank thou. I just love those bluespot jawfish. I need to get me one of those 
|
|
vadryn
Guest
Joined: February 05 2007
Location: North Logan
Status: Offline
Points: 771
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 15 2009 at 10:43am |
|
So - Do I need more than a half-dozen nesarrius snails to stir up my sandbed? The jawfish keeps stuff moving around in some areas, but should I get a starfish or more snails that'll keep churning the sand?
|
|
bfessler
Guest
Joined: March 13 2009
Location: Lehi
Status: Offline
Points: 1708
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 15 2009 at 10:50am |
Thanks for the pics Vardyn. If your shooting for the same type of look on the 210 I'm sure you'll do just fine with the same techniques you are currently using. The xenia, Kenya trees, mushrooms and other softies are great additions to the filtration of the tank and thrive on nutrient rich water.
Dew2loud1,
I agree with the DSB Time Bomb analogy if the sand bed is simply left to gather waste and is not serviced properly. I stir my sand bead around the edges weekly because I don't like the look of accumulating waste at the glass and then stir portions of the rest of the bed once a month. This brings up all kinds of stuff that feed the corals and keep the sand bed healthy. It's easy to stir the bed all the way to the bottom with a turkey baster. I was a little afraid of doing it at first and bringing all the gunk up into the water column but every time I do the corals look better than ever the next day.
|
Burt
An equal opportunity reefer,
I support all hobbyists and organizations involved in Marine Aquarium Keeping.
[email protected]
|
|
bfessler
Guest
Joined: March 13 2009
Location: Lehi
Status: Offline
Points: 1708
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 15 2009 at 10:56am |
Just get a turkey baster and fill with tank water. Then hold it an inch or so from the sand bed and blast it. Like I said in the last post I do the edges frequently and the center less often. If I had a large tank I would do the edges weekly and then about 1/4 of the sand each week so you're not disturbing the entire sand bed at one time.
|
Burt
An equal opportunity reefer,
I support all hobbyists and organizations involved in Marine Aquarium Keeping.
[email protected]
|
|
Jeffs_little_ocean
Guest
Joined: October 04 2009
Location: Kaysville
Status: Offline
Points: 869
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 15 2009 at 11:02am |
|
Cerith snails do an awesome job at stirring the sandbed and they will also clean the rocks and glass. There are also several kinds of gobies that do the same.
|
|
CapnMorgan
Guest
The Capn'
Joined: August 19 2009
Location: Tooele
Status: Offline
Points: 3537
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 15 2009 at 2:33pm |
|
I second Burt's post. I use the turkey baster method in my tank to stir the sand bed in both my display and my refugium. It puts out all sorts of goodies for the corals, clams, sponges, and feather dusters. It's cheap and easy. I got my basters from the dollar tree 2 for a buck. I use one to stir the sand and I attached a stiff tube to the end of the other so I can target feed all my corals without getting wet.
|
Steve My Old 180G Mixed ReefCurrently: 120G Wavefront Mixed 29G Seahorse & Softies Running ReefAngel Plus x2 435-8
|
|
Mark Peterson
Paid Member
Joined: June 19 2002
Location: Murray
Status: Offline
Points: 21436
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 19 2009 at 9:31am |
 thefu wrote:
I have never seen a successful SPS tank run like that. |
I wouldn't expect that you had. Could you please try to be less critical/judgemental until you have been at this hobby a lot longer?
The first pic I posted is not the best of that tank. I'm sorry I don't have that setup any more so that you could come see it. I'll try to post more pics. That tank was not set up for looks, btw. 
Also, in my experience, the fear of NS2 gas destruction is making a mountain out of a molehill. Certainly a hobbyist using a very deep sand bed must be cautious and avoid stirring the whole deep bed, but a little stirring, even deep stirring in a select spot is not going to cause any problem. The only time I ever had a problem was when I tore down a tank and the one fish I hadn't caught/hadn't seen, died immediately when the entire sand bed was disturbed. 
|
Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244 Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member 
|
|
BobC63
Admin Group
Joined: January 17 2007
Location: Lehi, UT
Status: Offline
Points: 8971
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 19 2009 at 4:30pm |
First off , I think Travis' setup looks pretty good
I think the main deterrent to adding SPS in his current 90g is not lack of a skimmer but rather the lighting (not that there is anything wrong with it) because if my memory is correct he is using PC lighting... so if he was to put a few digi or monti cap frags in it they would need to be way high up on the rockwork.
My only criticism would be that I would still do some partial water changes every month or so. I don't know if Travis' comments meant that he has gone 7 months without a WC and plans to not do any in the future, or maybe he was just questioning the logic of doing frequent WCs when his tank has been up for 7 months without any.
To do it "on the cheap", go out and get an 18g rubbermaid tote to hold the new water (for around $5 at WalMart) then all you need is a small heater and a maxijet type powerhead to heat / mix the new water and you're set for WCs. The salt cost shouldn't be too prohibitive; if you change 10g per month (plenty for your setup) a 160g salt bucket will last close to 1 1/2 years before you need to buy salt again. IMO, $25 - 30 per year for salt is not a prohibitve expense; you are probably spending more than that yearly for the carbon in the canister.
|
|
- My Current Tank: 65g Starfire (sitting empty for 2+ years) -
* Marine & Reef tanks since 1977 *
|
|
vadryn
Guest
Joined: February 05 2007
Location: North Logan
Status: Offline
Points: 771
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 19 2009 at 5:07pm |
|
You are right on the Water Change. I've found that with my FX5 I can remove and replace the water in my tank with very little effort using the unit's hoese and pump. Worked very slick. I'm not opposed to doing WC on a regular basis, and in fact plan on 10g monthly now. I also am going to get a bunch more sandsifting critters as well as a turkey baster.
|
|
Mark Peterson
Paid Member
Joined: June 19 2002
Location: Murray
Status: Offline
Points: 21436
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 20 2009 at 7:17am |
The best sand cleaner is a Sand Sifting Cucumber (or two) in that tank. Stay away from the SSStars because they eat the life in the sand. One SSStar can ruin a large live sand bed within 4 months. They are useful in a really dirty sand bed but should be removed after a month or two and replaced with cukes. Yours does not appear to be a really dirty sand bed.
One of the neat things that happens in a tank where a lot of the nutrients in the form of detritus and organic molecules are not removed, is the amount and diversity of microscopic life that develops. This adds to the pleasure of the "hobby biologist" in each of us and produces a lot of natural food for the coral, inverts and fish. This is what I mean when I speak of the older aquarium becoming healthier; what the books call "stability".
Thanks to Burt for sharing his success with sand bed maintenance.
Edited by Mark Peterson - November 20 2009 at 7:21am
|
Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244 Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member
|
|
vadryn
Guest
Joined: February 05 2007
Location: North Logan
Status: Offline
Points: 771
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 20 2009 at 8:16am |
Yesterday my nine year old was pointing out the little critters that were alive and moving in the little pockets of space in the sandbed (pods, right?) Now there's one HUGE advantage to not cleaning the front glass (below the sand line) too much.
That's great to know about the SS Star. I will steer clear and get another cuke. This place I'm going to order from has "cleaner clams" and "sand sifting crabs" both of which stir up the sand but don't eat the beneficial life there.
With my tank being about 8 months old, should I still look to add new LR or LS to get "new" microscopic life added to the mix?
|
|
bfessler
Guest
Joined: March 13 2009
Location: Lehi
Status: Offline
Points: 1708
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 20 2009 at 8:48am |
It's probably not necessary to add new LR or LS at this point as every time you add something to your tank you get some new life. If you really want to add diversity you could swap a cup or so of sand with a friend but be aware that if there is a nuisance in his tank you may be bringing it to yours as well.
If you like the look of dirty sand at the front glass then by all beans don't clean it. You can still show off the creatures that live in the sand with your kids by looking at the tank with a flashlight in the dark. You'd be surprised how many things come out in the dark.
|
Burt
An equal opportunity reefer,
I support all hobbyists and organizations involved in Marine Aquarium Keeping.
[email protected]
|
|
Mark Peterson
Paid Member
Joined: June 19 2002
Location: Murray
Status: Offline
Points: 21436
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 20 2009 at 11:48am |
Cleaner clams and cleaner crabs...I don't believe those claims as regarding cleaning the sand and I would check them out and ask here before buying. Someone here has probably already had some experience with them. For example, you can buy live saltwater mussels and clams at the grocery store that clean the water as they siphon it for food. They don't last very long, starving within a year because our tankwater is not dirty enough.
When I worked at MSM (Mountain Shadow Marine in Centerville), with easy access to uncured LR fresh from the ocean at the employee discount, occasionally I brought home small pieces of the best LR, adding it's diversity to my system. It was great.
I know, I'm the guy that pushes LBTR to help save the wild reefs and here I was adding some wild LR to my system.  It was only a little bit and then after it had shared it's diversity in my system, I shared it with other hobbyists here in the WMAS. |
Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244 Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member
|
|
vadryn
Guest
Joined: February 05 2007
Location: North Logan
Status: Offline
Points: 771
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 20 2009 at 12:06pm |
I keep getting told how "nutrient rich" my tank is, given my setup, so I am not sure I'm going to be starving a filter-feeder... but I don't know. The Clams are from Florida, so they aren't cold water varieties at least. The Crabs are filter feeders that burrow in the sand. Neither of those feed from the sandbed, but both would disturb the sand, which is the desired affect.
There are disadvantages to having a deep sand bed and an OCD Bluespot Jawfish. Stuff that doesn't move doesn't stay on top of the sand bed for long as he continually excavates. I think I need to get a bunch of rubble and put in there to help define and end to his expansive digging.
|
|
sanddune600
Guest
Joined: February 20 2008
Location: Logan
Status: Offline
Points: 1825
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: November 21 2009 at 1:03pm |
|
I had one of those clams I put it in the corner of my tank and it stayed in the same spot for a year they DONT move in the sand or any where really he was in a 28g nano I sold him with the tank though
also from the pics I wouldnt say that you have lots of excess waste if you did your tank would be growing algea and the sand would look alot more murky imo
Edited by sanddune600 - November 21 2009 at 1:05pm
|
|
Andy Jorgensen
My number is four three 5 7 six four 8 0 three four
|
|
