| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
Kromlech 
Guest
Joined: March 08 2016
Location: West Jordan
Status: Offline
Points: 163
|
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote  Reply
 Topic: Stocking Ideas for 34 Gal aquarium
Posted: July 13 2016 at 3:21pm |
Hey all,
I'm about to start setting up a new tank, after downgrading from my 90 gal, and I need some stocking ideas.
What I currently have as far as live stock
3 different Zoa frags. 1 Acan Frag 2 emerald crabs some Cerith and Nerite snails
What I know I want. 2 clowns 1 BTA Tiger Goby 1 dwarf angel 1 cleaner shrimp or 1 Coral banded shrimp
other than that, I am not sure what else I should or could house in the tank safely or should put in the tank...
throw me some ideas, and why you would recommend them.
|
|
50.3 AIO Waterbox
|
 |
Krazie4Acans
Admin Group
Joined: December 17 2012
Location: Syracuse
Status: Offline
Points: 24177
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 3:26pm |
|
Trying to get a Cleaner and Coral banded to get along in a 34 is gonna be tough. I have them in my 90 and they still can't seam to get along.
If it's covered then firefish would do well in there.
What other corals are you planning to add that will have an impact on your fish choice as well.
|
My ocean. 90g (yup, won it!), 40g, 28g, & 10g Systems PADI Advanced Open Water Tank Thread:
|
|
Kromlech
Guest
Joined: March 08 2016
Location: West Jordan
Status: Offline
Points: 163
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 3:37pm |
well I want one shrimp or the other, just haven't decided on it yet.
I was thinking I should get something to manage Algae and graze but unsure of what would work in that size of tank. obviously tangs even the smaller kole, or tomini wouldnt work.
only other corals I really want are a Hammer or a Frogspawn, and a duncan.
|
|
50.3 AIO Waterbox
|
|
Krazie4Acans
Admin Group
Joined: December 17 2012
Location: Syracuse
Status: Offline
Points: 24177
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 3:45pm |
|
Ah, sorry I thought I read one of each shrimp. :) I would recommend the cleaner.
Lawnmower blenny (or any other small blenny) could help some with algae. Pretty much all tangs are out of the question unless you have some place for them to go after they quickly outgrow that tank. Cardinals would do well in that tank but don't do much for algae. There are quite a few different varieties of them as well.
Those corals won't really effect your fish choices so you should be good to go.
|
My ocean. 90g (yup, won it!), 40g, 28g, & 10g Systems PADI Advanced Open Water Tank Thread:
|
|
bstuver
Guest
Joined: April 17 2006
Location: Provo
Status: Offline
Points: 9386
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 3:54pm |
|
My tank is a 42g as for helping with algae I went the route of a lot of snails and some blue leg hermits. I had some patches of algae that were driving me crazy and once I upped the numbers of those those patches are now gone, I think it was the turbos and the blue legs that took care of it.
As for fish I love my cardinals, you'll probably want to add the dwarf angel last as they can be more territorial than other fish
|
|
Jackie Stuver
"wait these aren't the happy Hawaiians oompa doompa godly heaven on your face zoas? I dont want them then. lol!" Ksmart
|
|
Kromlech
Guest
Joined: March 08 2016
Location: West Jordan
Status: Offline
Points: 163
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 4:03pm |
I really wish I could find Trocus snails, I just like the way they clean much better than turbo's plus they can flip themselves over... and there just a little less bulldozery hahaha
I am looking at blennies, and I have to say I'm really liking the bi-color blenny.
I've owned cleaners in the past and enjoy them, why do you recommend them over the CBS?
|
|
50.3 AIO Waterbox
|
|
Krazie4Acans
Admin Group
Joined: December 17 2012
Location: Syracuse
Status: Offline
Points: 24177
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 4:07pm |
|
Bi-colors are good. I have a tail spot and a bi-color and the tailspot is much more visible in the tank. The bi-color hides a lot.
Cleaners have never caused me tank problems but CBS get mean as they get bigger and will catch fish if they can. I even had a friend that had one that was eating his zoas.
|
My ocean. 90g (yup, won it!), 40g, 28g, & 10g Systems PADI Advanced Open Water Tank Thread:
|
|
Kromlech
Guest
Joined: March 08 2016
Location: West Jordan
Status: Offline
Points: 163
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 4:17pm |
|
Cleaner shrimp it is!!!
|
|
50.3 AIO Waterbox
|
|
bstuver
Guest
Joined: April 17 2006
Location: Provo
Status: Offline
Points: 9386
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 4:42pm |
|
Yeah I got some small turbos from jays Jungle here in Provo, I don't like the large ones either as they knock everything over. These ones have been great. Although I will need to remove them soon as I plan to add a bunch of my decorative macros to my main tank and they will munch them
Edited by bstuver - July 13 2016 at 4:43pm
|
|
Jackie Stuver
"wait these aren't the happy Hawaiians oompa doompa godly heaven on your face zoas? I dont want them then. lol!" Ksmart
|
|
Mark Peterson
Paid Member
Joined: June 19 2002
Location: Murray
Status: Offline
Points: 21437
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 5:19pm |
I agree with everything said above, especially Jackie's suggestion that lot's of snails and some hermits are the best way to keep algae in check, no matter what size of tank. That said, I don't recommend this for beginners or even novice hobbyists but check out this thread about a tank half the size with a Yellow Tang. It went in 8 months ago. It's currently fat and happy and still doing awesome:
If you're interested, let me know and I'll be happy to teach you the finer points of how to do it.
Aloha, Mark  |
Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244 Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member 
|
|
Reefer4Ever
Guest
Joined: May 18 2014
Location: South Weber
Status: Offline
Points: 1120
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 13 2016 at 8:55pm |
|
Just another thought and that is don't over feed and cause excess nitrates and phosphates. If you plan to run a skimmer you can carbon dose as well. You can use AA in a mesh bag to help remove excess phosphates. I personally love to feed a lot 6 cubes a day and have fat happy fish and to say we have 5 green chromis all together and not killing one another says they are just to fat to care about one another much lol.
|
|
90 gal reef w/refugium
24 gal softie tank
11 gal nano anemone tank
5 gal fresh water
|
|
Kromlech
Guest
Joined: March 08 2016
Location: West Jordan
Status: Offline
Points: 163
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 14 2016 at 8:29am |
Mark,
I know YT are a pretty decent sized tang once at adult size, Could I get away with a Tomini or a Kole tang by those same standards?
|
|
50.3 AIO Waterbox
|
|
Mark Peterson
Paid Member
Joined: June 19 2002
Location: Murray
Status: Offline
Points: 21437
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 14 2016 at 9:37am |
Well the thing is, if it's a small, juvenile fish and it's fed just enough but not too much, it will stay on the small side, be healthy and be a good tank mate. That said, I really shouldn't recommend this to anyone but the most advanced hobbyists that have done dozens of tanks over a dozen years or so. It is quite a balancing act involving just the right amount of: 1) live algae, 2) supplemental feedings, 3) circulation, 4) filtration media and 5) tank maintenance procedures.
There are differences between what these different Tangs can handle. In the wild, Zebrasoma sp. can live right up against the rocks at the shoreline, while other Tangs are the residents of more open waters. In other words, in order to be happy, some Tangs need more room to swim.
While I was away living in Hawaii, I recommended that Dentist's tank to an experienced aquarium maintenance company. Unfortunately, they completely messed it up. When they lost control of algae, they switched out the rock and sand. By the time I got back, nuisance algae was again out of control and the Dentist practically begged me to come back. 
This points to the most common reef aquarium mistake, which is, IMO, a misunderstanding of the role of herbivorous Snails and their counterparts. Stocking and periodically re-stocking a tank with enough herbivorous Snails is, in my opinion, by far the most valuable maintenance tool we have. The quantity of herbivorous snails is typically underestimated by beginner hobbyists and too often, non-herbivorous snails are ignorantly purchased because of low price.
The snail's counterparts, comrades in the control of nuisance algae, are the Hermit Crab and the tiny algae eating bugs. The most common bugs are Amphipods and Copepods. There is a special knack to providing a good environment for herbivorous bugs.
Please don't misunderstand. I'm not saying that this way is the only way to do it, but IMO it is one of the healthiest ways. There are alternatives to algae control that we can discuss, if we have to. 
Aloha, Mark
Edited by Mark Peterson - July 14 2016 at 10:02am
|
Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244 Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member
|
|
Kromlech
Guest
Joined: March 08 2016
Location: West Jordan
Status: Offline
Points: 163
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 14 2016 at 9:50am |
Hmm, While I have only had one SW tank, and 20+ different FW tanks, I would not call myself advanced by any means, theirs always more to learn it seems, and everyone does everything differently especially in the SW aquarium world. I think I'll stick with my plans for now and go with this below stock.
Fish: 2 Clowns 1 Dwarf Angel 1 Bi-color Blenny
1 Tiger Goby 2 Bangaii Cardinals
Inverts: 1 BTA 1-2 Cleaner Shrimp 6 Cerith Snails
6 Nerite Snails 4 Trocus Snails (when I can find them....) 2 Emerald Crabs
4 blue leg Hermits
Corals: 3 zoa types
1 Hammer/Frog Spawn 1 Acan
1 Duncan
seems like a really long list, but I think this should work. What do you all think?
Edited by Kromlech - July 22 2016 at 8:13am
|
|
50.3 AIO Waterbox
|
|
Mark Peterson
Paid Member
Joined: June 19 2002
Location: Murray
Status: Offline
Points: 21437
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 14 2016 at 10:35am |
That's good.
One thing I might say is that 16 snails may not be sufficient. I often talk about having one Snail/gal. and yet some mature tanks do well with 1/4 that number. It depends partly on the amount of mature LR and LS the tank is started with (influencing the size of the bug population and Stomatella Snail population), partly on how much Macroalgae is used for start-up(more macro means less available nutrients/pollution), partly on how rapidly the larger animals are introduced, and partly on the type, amount and intensity of light. May I suggest, rather than put a set number to the amount of Snails, think of snails from a different perspective:
Are there enough Snails for the time being? How often do I have to scrape algae off the glass? (this question is not about clean glass ) What is the general appearance of the LR? Is it turning shades of brown in spots? Is it turning green in spots? Is Coralline Algae starting to spread? (this question is about too many hungry Hermits) Is nuisance algae starting to sprout anywhere on the LR? What type and how extensive? Am I seeing any areas of Cyano or diatom growth? How large are those areas?
These are just some of the questions I ask myself as I watch a new tank grow. The answers tell me what the tank needs.
I really don't understand the hobbyist interest in Trochus Snails. They are no better at eating algae than the same size Astrea and yet they cost 4x more. Small Pacific Turbo Snails eat more than Trochus and cost half as much. Is there something I'm missing? Please enlighten me.
Aloha, Mark
Edited by Mark Peterson - July 14 2016 at 10:42am
|
Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244 Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member
|
|
Kromlech
Guest
Joined: March 08 2016
Location: West Jordan
Status: Offline
Points: 163
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 14 2016 at 11:00am |
I think the trocus is liked so much, because they can flip themselves over if they get stuck on their back. just makes for less of a hassle. haha. I have considered astreas, but most things ive read about them, people always seem to say how much trocus or turbos are better.
I don't like turbos because of the bulldozers that they are. So I may have to try the Astrea's
now all of those are great questions, but I am using white dry rock, unfortunately so the greens and browns are really prevalent it seems for the first little bit. (or at least how it appears to me) and the coraline seems to take a while. any algae that ive ever seen on my rocks, was always eaten by the Emerald Crabs that I have. I figured 16 snails was a good starting point, as I don't want to over stock and have a die off with a huge addition of nutrients added back into the tank.
|
|
50.3 AIO Waterbox
|
|
arthuriv
Presidency
Joined: August 08 2009
Location: Tooele, Ut
Status: Offline
Points: 2551
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 14 2016 at 12:43pm |
 Kromlech wrote:
I think the trocus is liked so much, because they can flip themselves over if they get stuck on their back. just makes for less of a hassle. haha. I have considered astreas, but most things ive read about them, people always seem to say how much trocus or turbos are better.
I don't like turbos because of the bulldozers that they are. So I may have to try the Astrea's
now all of those are great questions, but I am using white dry rock, unfortunately so the greens and browns are really prevalent it seems for the first little bit. (or at least how it appears to me) and the coraline seems to take a while. any algae that ive ever seen on my rocks, was always eaten by the Emerald Crabs that I have. I figured 16 snails was a good starting point, as I don't want to over stock and have a die off with a huge addition of nutrients added back into the tank. |
I think 16-20 snails to start in a brand new tank probably isn't a bad idea and then add more it you notice their not able to keep up. Once more established you might need to have 30-40+ snails to keep algae under control but it all depends on many variables. Like Mark said there really isn't a magic number of snails you should put in your tank. They are more like guidelines. So I say if you want to start with 16 go for it and just add more if they can't keep up. Though if you find the Trochus snails you want you should probably buy as many as you like to have then because they aren't always available for purchase.
|
|
Quality Marines Aquaculturing & Captive Breeding program!
Presented by Ashley & Chelsea from Reef On
Thursday 6 Oct 2016
|
|
reefnfeef
Guest
Joined: March 21 2012
Location: Sugarhouse, SLC
Status: Offline
Points: 732
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 14 2016 at 3:03pm |
I think your stock list looks great. I used to have a 34gal RSM and it was stocked with essentially exactly what your proposed list is except I had a potters angel and a yellow assessor instead of a blenny. Tank ran well with minimal water changes for almost 3 years until I got a bigger tank.
I think it's always a good idea to start with less snails and add more if needed, so there isn't a snail die off adding excess nutrients to the system.
I would recommend seeding the tank with a probiotic or multiple probiotics. I used both Seachem's Stability and Aquavitro's Seed on my newest tank system when I set it up dry. I have less than 10 in my 200 and barely have enough algae to feed the snails as is. I am a huge fan of probiotics for seeding a tank quickly and effectively. From the time the system was filled with water (beginning of May) to livestock was just over 2 days. There was a small algae bloom for about 3 days, chaeto quadrupled size and since then my chaeto has slowly been disappearing due to lack of nutrients despite how much I feed. I feed my tank, with the exception of the eel, at least 5 times a day with various flake, pellet, and LRS foods. Plus I clip about 2-3grams of nori at least once - sometimes twice - a day.
Livestock includes: 22" golden moray eel. 6-7" naso tang 6-7" mag fox face 5" purple tang 5" RS sail fin 4" emperor mating saddleback clown pair a few chromis tailspot blenny
|
|
aaaaaaaaaaaaaannd.... I'm broke
|
|
Kromlech
Guest
Joined: March 08 2016
Location: West Jordan
Status: Offline
Points: 163
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 14 2016 at 3:52pm |
|
I have seeded rock and live sand from my old tank still running in one of my buddies system, as well as some cerith and nerite snails, 2 emerald crabs and 4/6 of the corals listed above. So it should adapt pretty quickly I am thinking. Ill give it 2 weeks to make sure.
|
|
50.3 AIO Waterbox
|
|
Mark Peterson
Paid Member
Joined: June 19 2002
Location: Murray
Status: Offline
Points: 21437
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: July 15 2016 at 10:54am |
Yes, I recommend starting with just a few Snails and adding more as needed. I agree with what has been said above and think that Trochus Snails look cool, but let me add that not using Astrea Snails because they " get stuck on their back" would be missing out on one of the best reef Snails there is.
It's true that Astrea, when first received, have difficulty righting themselves. There is a very good reason for this. They are weak and almost starving to death after holding and transport from the waters south of Florida and the Caribbean. Starvation caused by Holding and transport are one of the major causes of all reef animal death. Yet, Astrea can live for many years eating great quantities nuisance algae and can become almost as large as a Pacific Turbo Snail.
Price-wise and benefit-wise I believe Astrea are the best reef snail overall. I try to use 50% Astrea, 25% Cerith and 25% Margarita Snails in my aquariums. Pacific Turbo Snails are used when the rock and coral are secure enough to handle their bulldozing or when the red cotton candy algae, Asperigopsis, is present.
This is how I help them adjust: 1. If purchased locally, I acclimate the quick way by exchanging water for 10 minutes, then hold them out of water for 10-15 seconds. Being out of water for this short period makes them happy to get back into the water despite any slight differences in parameters. 2. I place them in the tank, piling them together near glass or rock. Putting them in a pile allows them to grab hold of each other and crawl onto the glass, rock and sand where soft surface algae is growing for them to immediately start eating. (Remember they are starving  so make sure there is algae.)3. With a long stick I right any that have not grabbed hold or are upside down on the sand. 4. Within the first week or so, if any fall onto the sand, I use a stick to push them back over to the rock or glass so they can grab hold and crawl away.
In a week or two, they are strong enough to hold tightly to the surface, but if they do fall, they are usually strong enough to reach way out and grab hold of something to right themselves.
Hope this helps.
Aloha, Mark |
Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244 Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member
|
|
