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What return pump for 150 wide

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Bluespotjawfish View Drop Down
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    Posted: June 11 2009 at 6:25am
I am in the process of purchasing a 150 wide tank in Texas.  It will have a single overflow, but the drain will be upgraded to a 1-1/2" bulkhead.
 
What return pump would you recommend?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nick801 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 7:16am
imo Id just do a mag 9.5 and just use power heads for flow =)


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Im running a dart on mine. Oceans motion 4 way with 4 returns.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rioreefer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 9:07am
I would go bigger than a 9.5 I have 2Xmag 9.5 on my 90Gal one ran to each side the split into two ant the top to form a Y with "flex" the ball and skocket tubing the name I am drawing a blank on ,but Im not a big fan of PH in the tanks. If its already plumbed then go Mag 24 or better yet externial for less heat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dew2loud1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 9:55am
Where do you want your flow coming from, return pump or in tank powerheads.  Its far less costly to use a moderate return mag 9 or eheim 1260,1262 and run koralia, tunze, votechs etc in tank for flow.  Running a snapper ro dart on a OM 4 way is also a good alternative, are there any returns drilled in the tank or do you want to take them over the top?
Another great return pump is the laguna line (same as red dragon) you could use a 1500 or 2000 and get great return rates and low electricity usage.
What are you doing for a sump? and do you want an internal or external return pump?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chk4tix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 10:07am
I was running a mag 12 on my dual overflow for the 120, but if I only had a single I probably would have used a mag 9.5. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote downhill_biker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 10:21am
i have to agree with dion and go with the dart. the mag pumps use a lot of electricity for their size and add a lot of heat to the tank. the reeflo dart however is very efficient, well most efficient in the industry, and it adds very little heat, and is super quiet. it also uses less electricity when you throttle it back and put a ball valve on it. it has the power to run your whole tank with one pump, or a skimmer, ect, but uses less electricity. seems like a no brainer to me. you can find them used on reef central all the time, or on ebay for great prices.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sukie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 12:47pm
The darts are awesome!  But I don't know for a return pump. . . i would get something that you could throttle up or down depending on the flow you want in the tank.  Do I have any recommendations. . not really.  I have a Mag7 and I used a partial closed union to throttle it down.  (that's right ppl!  it was too much flow. . hahaWink)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote downhill_biker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 12:56pm
the dart would definitely work perfect for a return pump. you can throttle up or down depending on how much flow you need, and unlike other pumps, when you throttle down, it uses less electricity.

i am going to use a reeflo barracuda for my return pump. should work great. just like the dart, but bigger.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vadryn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 12:59pm
I have a Mag 24 for my 225g (FW) and started with a mag 9.5, then went to two of them, then the Mag 24.  I could have saved a lot of time and money by going with a sufficient pump to begin with.  If/when I convert this to SW I'll have to add additional flow and may go with a couple powerheads to target specific areas, but I wouldn't go smaller on the pump.
 
Electricity wise, powerheads may be cheaper, but they are ugly, and throwing a bunch of powerheads into the sytem just creates a bunch of points of failure on top of things to hide.
 
One last thing, the size of your sump/fuge will affect this.  If you put a 20g system under your tank a bigger pump would be too much, but if you are going to run a *good sized* sump/fuge, go with a larger pump.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Corey Price Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 1:29pm
I like Sequence pumps, but the flow you need from the sump to the tank is much less than what a Dart can produce for a 150 gallon tank. This whole thread is crazy talk, especially without knowing what kind of sump Lorraine is going to use. If you have a big sump, you can run a big pump if you want.

In my own experience of having a massive, single return pump, I would do it different for sure.

Why put a Dart on a tank with overflows that can't handle it full-throttle? It's not the drain that causes the problem with a lot of flow, it's usually limited by the overflow teeth or weir length. Seems silly to me, honestly. A Mag 9.5 or 12 would be reliable, somewhat quiet, cheap, etc. Use a Korallia or Stream powerhead with a mag pump or an ehiem and forget the giant return pumps. A mag pump doesn't contribute a considerable amount of heat to a 150 gallon tank, really.

If you want a Sequence, then get a Snapper. It uses much less power and produces less flow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chk4tix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 1:32pm
Originally posted by Corey Price Corey Price wrote:

I like Sequence pumps, but the flow you need from the sump to the tank is much less than what a Dart can produce for a 150 gallon tank. This whole thread is crazy talk, especially without knowing what kind of sump Lorraine is going to use. If you have a big sump, you can run a big pump if you want.

In my own experience of having a massive, single return pump, I would do it different for sure.

Why put a Dart on a tank with overflows that can't handle it full-throttle? It's not the drain that causes the problem with a lot of flow, it's usually limited by the overflow teeth or weir length. Seems silly to me, honestly. A Mag 9.5 or 12 would be reliable, somewhat quiet, cheap, etc. Use a Korallia or Stream powerhead with a mag pump or an ehiem and forget the giant return pumps. A mag pump doesn't contribute a considerable amount of heat to a 150 gallon tank, really.

If you want a Sequence, then get a Snapper. It uses much less power and produces less flow.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dion Richins Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 8:30pm
#1 consideration for any tank is flow. Corey is right about the lack of knowledge of what size sump she is using. However I highly doubt that she would be using a 20g sump on a 150. My 150 has a 55g sump. It has 1 overflow with 2 drains and it handles the flow from a dart with out even blinking. My 125 had the dual overflows and I did modify the teeth. (cut them out and screened them) Worked like a charm.
 
My 180 has the dual overflows with the same modification. It runs a Hammerhead at about 3/4 open. If fully opened it would run all 4 returns. (thats right 4 returns. 2 normal and 2 back up for safety) But then again it also has 2 darts for closed loops.
 
Again the train of thought at this time is that its as important if not more than light. If you cant get food to them they cant eat.
 
My new tank with be running the above mentioned dart with the oceans motion as a return pump with either a second dart for the closed loop or a set of polaria's for supplementation. ( I can hide them) I personally don't like to see power heads but with the failure of my 125 I'm rethinking the drilling of the new tank for a closed loop. My sump for this tank is 2' x 4' x20" tall.
 
As far as heat. Rubbish. I ran 2 mag 18 on my 125 for return. Switching to the dart dropped 5 degrees off of my tank temp. I would not go back to a in sump return again if at all possible.
 
However this is all about personal choices. We all have different ideas and feelings about what works best. I don't feel anyone posting is full of crazy talk. Everyone so far has posted their opinion and has offered some reasoning behind it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nick801 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 10:06pm
well one reason Id stick with mag 9 is that the water that comes into my sump is already a ton of flow (lots of bubbles etc) I even have to throttle the flow down... I don't like filter socks so I'm pretty sure if I went with any bigger of a return Id be messed up with micro bubbles etc

I have my drains set up as (2) 1'inch flex lines and it is quite a bit of flow....



Edited by Nick801 - June 11 2009 at 10:07pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote downhill_biker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 10:35pm
for all the nay sayers, i can think of one good reason he may want to go with a dart on the tank: THE FUTURE. he may want to run a closed loop, may want to run a skimmer, may want to feed a uv sterilizer, may want to feed a carbon reactor, ect, ect. the price difference isn't that much. the power difference isn't that much. less than 50w and well on marine depot there is no difference in price...lol. the snapper is 1900gph at 4' of head, so dual 1" overflows would do about 1500gph and he would have a measly 400gph to run anything else he decided to run. if he went with the dart, it would be 3035gph at 4' of head, and he could feed a large skimmer, uv sterilizer, and a closed loop. there are lots of options to weigh out here, but calling the thread "crazy talk" is pushing it, if he wont ever need the extra flow, go for the snapper, if, "if" theres ever a slight chance that he will use the extra flow, he should bite the bullet of $0 dollars and get the dart.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tcfab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 10:50pm

I am with Dion and downhill, Reeflo pumps are very nice you won't be disappointed.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BobC63 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2009 at 11:15pm

I like to go with a return pump that flows only 3 - 5 X tank volume per hour; IMO more than that and your skimmer and / or refugium lose "efficiency" because a high gph through your sump means alot of water passes through the sump without going through the skimmer...

 On my 225 I use "only" a single return pump that flows around 700 gph after head pressure. My skimmer pump flows around the same amount. In theory this should mean that almost all the water that flows through the sump also gets skimmed before being pumped back into the display...
 
For additional display flow I prefer circ pumps like Korallias or Vortechs
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bluespotjawfish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 14 2009 at 8:37am
Wow, I forgot I even posted this.  Look at all the excitement.  I haven't gotten this much feedback from this board ever.  I'll have to check out some of the ideas on here.
 
The sump they were quoting me was a little tiny one, so they are going to change that.
 
I won't do a Mag pump because of my recent past experience with them.  Other than that I haven't decided yet.  I'm seriously looking at the Ehiem pumps, but haven't looked at some of the options you have offered.
 
I know the last time I was working with return pumps I started with a Iwaki55, then went to the Iwaki40, and ended up with the Iwaki30RLT before I wasn't splashing water on the floor.
 
Based on what I run on the 125, I'm thinking I want something in the range of 900 gph, after accounting for the head loss.  The only internal pump I will have is my vortech pump on the opposite side of the tank.  However, a pump that could also run my UV Sterilizer, carbon/phosban chambers would be cool too.  I'm going to be in Texas so not introducing heat will be important.  Energy efficiency is also important.  Reliability is important...Quiet is important...
 
So the tank has been ordered.  Just a reminder - it has a single corner overflow with an upsized drain.  The sump will probably be a custom sump ~42-48" in length with a refugium built in.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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