High Nitrates

I'm with Mark.

Adam

I'd like to know what Adam and Mark's opinions are on this. 

My thoughts are this.  First let me say that I really haven't read all of this thread as I'm just trying to catch up (been gone this week).
Nitrates are the end product.  Some people (Jake) now subscribe to the new notion that we need to rid nitrates and have nitrogen as the end product.  I agree with him, but really world wide this isn't the common perception.

I don't worry about nitrates.  Never have and probably never will.  I think things die all the time, but as long as you have tons of sand and rock with inverts you'll never notice. 

I don't know what else to say and this post of mine is already too long so ask more specific questions and I'll try to make up answers.

Adam

Some people (Jake) now subscribe to the new notion that we need to rid nitrates and have nitrogen as the end product.  I agree with him, but really world wide this isn't the common perception.

.  Adam, do we live in the same world?   Nitrate reduction is a new notion?

Jon and Mark- yes a NEW idea not widely known.  Pick up your favorite book (and let me know what that is) and read the part on filtration.  Even Baensch still says that nitrate is the end product.  Really (trust me here) most people try to get to the nitrate step, then water change that out. 

We've heard for years about nitrification and filtration.... but denitrification is a foreign term to most people.

Jeff- so sorry to hear all of that.  Hope you are up and running soon (although you already found your way back to the computer I see)

Adam

Adam, I don't believe you.  I've had tanks for a long time and have known about and desired to have denitrification in my fish tanks.  It was the reason I bought live rock back in the early 90s...

Mark, we just got back from the beach!  No mouse for me today.

Jon- I hate to say this but you bought your live rock for the wrong reasons.  Yes I know live rock does help in denitrification.  But that really depends on the rock.  If you look at a box of live rock you can find tons of pieces that are very nonporous.  Live rock should not be your primary source of denitrification (if you think denitrification is important).  Live rock is your basis for some bacteria, but is intended (or should be intended) to introduce the general living ecosystem of the tank.

Also just for fun...

"Yes, to be clear, we're stating that live rock does reduce nitrates (significant anaerobic nitririers exist in subsurface areas) and performs other biological faculties beyond that which any man-made filter can provide"  (Calfo & Fenner 2003) New enough concept they had to spell it out.

"Denitrification can also occur spontaneously in an aquarium, but uncontrolled denitrification is dangerious.  The bacteria reduce the nitrate to gaseious nitrogen, but not in one step.  There are a number of intermediates.  The most important intermediate is familiar to us from nitrification: nitrite." (Baensch 1994) 

"The Nitrogen Cycle in a conventional marine aquarium- nitrate accumulates as the end product of waste conversion." (Tullock 2001).

"In recent years, creative approaches to encouraging denitrification in the aquarium (where anaerobic conditions have traditionally been avoided) have gained much attention." (Fenner 2001)

"In fact, the problem with all the previous filtration mehtods is a "bottlenecking" of bacterial activity, in which aerobic bacterial activity produces nitrates as an end product." (Fenner 2001)

"To simplify a long, complex story, the current view is that letting these processes work along at a slower pace in live rock gives anaerobic bacteria a better chance to keep up the nitrate production, turning out nitrogen gas as the end product." (Fenner 2001)

"the nitrates in our example continue to rise and might build to danergous levels in a truly closed system.  Intervention methods by aquarists to successfully limit the "bottleneck" accumulation of nitrates include: frquent partial water changes, chemical filtrants, macroalgae "scrubbers", and abundandt live rock and live sand substrate beds, in which nitrate can be converted to harmless gaseous nitrogen." (Fenner 2001)

Adam