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Lurkerz 
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 Topic: 1 Cubic Foot Reef
Posted: January 26 2011 at 7:40pm |
My new desktop 1 cubic foot rimless lit with a Par38 LED   Rock stack 
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Lewy
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Posted: January 26 2011 at 7:50pm |
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Nicely done!!!
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40 gal w/ 20 sump
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Adam Blundell
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Posted: January 26 2011 at 8:04pm |
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Come to a meeting, they’re fun!
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Chris Scott
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Posted: January 28 2011 at 7:43pm |
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yea pretty sweet! how many gallons is that?
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55g Bowfront Corner Reef
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nanoman
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Posted: February 01 2011 at 2:29pm |
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im guessing 7 to 8
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Lurkerz
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Posted: February 01 2011 at 2:33pm |
Thanks
It is 7.5 gal 12"x12"x12"
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Ryan Thompson
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 9:05am |
How did you hang the light over the tank?
I was told that putting a PAR38 bulb in a housing like that will void any warranty. The bulbs need to be completely open because they produce quite a bit of heat.
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vadryn
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 9:36am |
I thought a major point of LED was to eliminate a lot of heat.  Why would an LED light be made to double as a heat source?
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Ryan Thompson
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 9:48am |
 vadryn wrote:
I thought a major point of LED was to eliminate a lot of heat. Why would an LED light be made to double as a heat source? |
A watt is a watt and all energy creates heat. 400 watts of LED will create the same heat as 400w of MH. That is physics.
The difference will be that the 400w of LED heat is spread out over a large area. The MH will be from a single, smaller area.
The PAR38 bulbs range in wattage but they have been designed with a heat sink to help shed heat away from them. Heat kills LED's more than anything else. Enclosing the bulbs does not allow the heat sink to work properly.
I know that if you talk to Nano Customs, Rapid LED, Boost LED or any other manufacture of the PAR bulbs, they will all tell you that the bulbs need to be open to the air and well ventilated or warranty will not be honored.
The reason you can create less heat is because you can use less wattage to light a tank. For example, if you have been running a 150w MH over a 20 gallon you can probably get away with two PAR bulbs. Thus you would be using around 40w now instead of 150w. You would lose 110w of heat being produced.
Edited by Ryan Thompson - February 10 2011 at 9:52am
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vadryn
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 9:54am |
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So are we being fed a line with LED lights? Why would anyone pay for LED when the wattage to produce light is the same, the heat is the same... ?? If having LED doesn't require less power (watts/heat) to produce light like we are told, then what's the point?
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Ryan Thompson
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 9:58am |
vadryn wrote:
So are we being fed a line with LED lights? Why would anyone pay for LED when the wattage to produce light is the same, the heat is the same... ?? If having LED doesn't require less power (watts/heat) to produce light like we are told, then what's the point? |
I don't think you are understanding this.
If you had 150w of LED you are more than likely running 50 - 3w LED's. That is enough to cover a pretty good sized tank. Try to cover that same tank with a single 150w MH and get the same PAR levels or same spread. NOT POSSIBLE. You would have to use two if not three of the 150w MH. Therefore with LED you half used at least half the power to light the tank.
LED's save you a ton of money when it comes to the electric bill.
Edited by Ryan Thompson - February 10 2011 at 10:00am
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vadryn
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 10:03am |
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Are we still talking about the 7.5 gallon, 1 cubic foot tank? 400w of LED over that? 500w you mentioned... ?? Where did these numbers come from? What's acutally being run over this tank? Maybe if we get back to apples=apples this wouldn't be so misleading.
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Ryan Thompson
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 10:06am |
vadryn wrote:
Are we still talking about the 7.5 gallon, 1 cubic foot tank? 400w of LED over that? 500w you mentioned... ?? Where did these numbers come from? What's acutally being run over this tank? Maybe if we get back to apples=apples this wouldn't be so misleading. |
He is running anywhere between 15 to 21w, would be my guess. It is a PAR38 bulb.
I simply made up some numbers to show that a watt is a watt. LED's don't break the laws of physics.
It doesn't matter if we are talking about 1 watt, 20 watts or 1,000,000 watts. ALL WATTS ARE CREATED EQUAL.
20 watts from T5 creates X amount of light. 20 watts from Metal Halide creates X amount of light. That amount of light will NOT be the same even though both have used the same wattage.
Edited by Ryan Thompson - February 10 2011 at 10:08am
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Lurkerz
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 10:08am |
The light fixture is hanging from a swag hook. and that particular housing has a 1 inch clearance all around the bulb and ventholes at the top. I was told this would be sufficient for the bulb. I can touch the heatsink on the bulb. It is very warm but not hot. Time will tell I guess if it works or not.
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Ryan Thompson
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 10:11am |
Lurkerz wrote:
The light fixture is hanging from a swag hook. and that particular housing has a 1 inch clearance all around the bulb and ventholes at the top. I was told this would be sufficient for the bulb. I can touch the heatsink on the bulb. It is very warm but not hot. Time will tell I guess if it works or not. |
Thank you! You can't tell in the pics so I thought I would ask.
I just remember reading on Nano Reef where a company wouldn't honor warranty because the guy enclosed his bulb. The heat killed the bulb pretty quick and he tried blaming the company for a faulty product.
When they showed him his OWN pictures he had no one to blame but himself.
I am really just interested in how you hung the light. I am getting a little tank like yours and am trying to figure out how to mount the dang bulb! 
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Lurkerz
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 11:07am |
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It is a clamp on fixture from HD that I put small S hooks into the vent holes then attached them to some black decorative chain the chain is hung by a swag hook and the cord running up the chain. I figured this way I could raise and lower the light with ease.
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Mark Peterson
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 11:55am |
Ryan Thompson wrote:
A watt is a watt and all energy creates heat. 400 watts of LED will create the same heat as 400w of MH. That is physics....The difference will be that the 400w of LED heat is spread out over a large area. The MH will be from a single, smaller area. |
That is incorrect. Wattage is the amount of electricity power being used by the item( volts x amps). It has absolutely nothing to do with light output, except it is useful when comparing identical light bulbs. That's why saying you have X number of watts per gallon is a useless measure. LED's produce more light and less heat than other light sources using the same amount of power/watts. PC lights are next best and MH are the worst as far as giving off a ton of heat for the amount of light produced.
Edited by Mark Peterson - February 10 2011 at 11:58am
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Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244 Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member 
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bfessler
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 12:17pm |
The new High Power LED's actually produce quite a bit of heat although not as much as MH. Even running at 50% power the heat-sink on Fu's tank is almost too hot to touch. The difference is that the heat is radiated up into the base as opposed to down and into the tank. That's why it's important to have an adequate heat sink and cooling fans when running High Power LED's otherwise they will fail prematurely.
The nice thing about LED's is that as long as the heat isn't trapped in the hood very little is radiated into the tank as it is absorbed by the heat-sink and dissipated by the cooling fans.
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Burt
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Ryan Thompson
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 3:46pm |
Mark Peterson wrote:
Ryan Thompson wrote:
A watt is a watt and all energy creates heat. 400 watts of LED will create the same heat as 400w of MH. That is physics....The difference will be that the 400w of LED heat is spread out over a large area. The MH will be from a single, smaller area. |
That is incorrect. Wattage is the amount of electricity power being used by the item( volts x amps). It has absolutely nothing to do with light output, except it is useful when comparing identical light bulbs. That's why saying you have X number of watts per gallon is a useless measure. LED's produce more light and less heat than other light sources using the same amount of power/watts. PC lights are next best and MH are the worst as far as giving off a ton of heat for the amount of light produced. |
Actually mark you are incorrect. All energy creates heat. A watt is a watt. The reason people think that PC and T5 don't produce as much heat as MH is because you can't "feel" it. When running a 150w halide you have 150w crammed in a tiny space. Get a T5 tube and make it 3-4 inches then cram 150w through it. Trust me it will get hot.
All energy creates heat. It just depends on how that heat is taken care of. I am not a scientist nor can I prove with formulas what I'm talking about but I've read more than enough threads and papers about the subject. There was a time when I believed like you that all watts weren't equal. A 50w heater will add just as much heat as a 50w internal pump.
Enough hijacking though of lurkerz thread. We can continue this elsewhere if you like.
Great tank Lurkerz! I hope to have mine set up within 60 days. Your light hanging idea has given me some ideas.
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Ryan Thompson
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Posted: February 10 2011 at 3:47pm |
Mark Peterson wrote:
Ryan Thompson wrote:
A watt is a watt and all energy creates heat. 400 watts of LED will create the same heat as 400w of MH. That is physics....The difference will be that the 400w of LED heat is spread out over a large area. The MH will be from a single, smaller area. |
That is incorrect. Wattage is the amount of electricity power being used by the item( volts x amps). It has absolutely nothing to do with light output, except it is useful when comparing identical light bulbs. That's why saying you have X number of watts per gallon is a useless measure. LED's produce more light and less heat than other light sources using the same amount of power/watts. PC lights are next best and MH are the worst as far as giving off a ton of heat for the amount of light produced. |
Actually mark you are incorrect. All energy creates heat. A watt is a watt. The reason people think that PC and T5 don't produce as much heat as MH is because you can't "feel" it. When running a 150w halide you have 150w crammed in a tiny space. Get a T5 tube and make it 3-4 inches then cram 150w through it. Trust me it will get hot.
All energy creates heat. It just depends on how that heat is taken care of. I am not a scientist nor can I prove with formulas what I'm talking about but I've read more than enough threads and papers about the subject. There was a time when I believed like you that all watts weren't equal. A 50w heater will add just as much heat as a 50w internal pump.
Enough hijacking though of lurkerz thread. We can continue this elsewhere if you like.
Great tank Lurkerz! I hope to have mine set up within 60 days. Your light hanging idea has given me some ideas.
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