Utah Reefs Homepage
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Mini Skimmer
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Mini Skimmer

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123>
Author
jfinch View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: March 06 2003
Location: Pleasant Grove
Status: Offline
Points: 7067
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Mini Skimmer
    Posted: May 31 2003 at 10:29pm

So, I've been fighting bubbles in my little 5 gallon sump....

I decided to put baffles in rather then a pile of live rock.  Here's a picture:

In order to add the baffles, I needed to replace my current skimmer since it was made to be inside the sump.  Here's a picture of it:

It worked ok, but was a constant battle to keep it skimming.  As you can see, the upper neck is white pvc... I could never tell where the level was.  So, I built a new one.  Here's a picture of it:

Here's a picture of the collection cup after starting up:

It hasn't really started to collect "gunk" yet... it'll take a few days to break in.  So far I really like the new sump and skimmer.  The baffles are working great!  No more filter sock or bubbles.

Here's a picture of the sump from above:

and here's a picture of the whole set-up:

Back to Top
rfoote View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: February 24 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1926
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rfoote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 31 2003 at 11:10pm
Jon - Looks nice!!!
Back to Top
Flaz View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: July 13 2002
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 188
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flaz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2003 at 8:57am

Jon- just curious about your design, how do you control the water level in you skimmer?  Can you adjust the height of the PVC tubes exiting the skimmer?

Back to Top
jfinch View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: March 06 2003
Location: Pleasant Grove
Status: Offline
Points: 7067
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2003 at 9:55am

That "fatter" piece of pvc, just after the water exits the box, is an expansion repair coupling.  It's completely water tight and telescopes about 3 inches.  The tee on the outlet is needed as a syphon break.  I've made skimmers in the past with valves on the outlet (like the ETSS skimmers), they work good too.  The expansion coupling is a bit more compact.

Some specs:

  • currently powered by a RIO 2100
  • 1/2 Mazzie venturi
  • 3 1/2 inch diam x 12 inch long main chamber
  • 2 inch diam x 5 inch long secondary chamber
  • 6 inch diam collection cup

The water exiting the box is for all intents and purposes, bubble free.  There are bubbles where it flows back into the sump, this is due to the syphon break (it sucks air down the tube).  These are big bubbles and are easily removed in the baffles.

I used extruded acrylic tubing which means it's only 1/8" thick.  In order to get a good glue line, the holes in the box and flanges were cut to the outside diameter of the tube and the tube slid into the hole.  This gave a 3/8" glue line at the box and a 1/4" glue line on the top flange.  Both the inlet and outlet from the box were drilled and tapped to accept pvc threaded fittings.  As you can see, I never found nylon thumbscrews, so I just used wingnuts.  A 4 inch diameter o-ring is used to seal the top flange.

Back to Top
jenjardu View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: November 21 2002
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 62
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jenjardu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 02 2003 at 12:56pm

Jon,

How do you build your own skimmer?  I mean this is one project that I would love to do, seeing as how I would like to have a skimmer but don't want to pay upwards of $200 for one.  How much did all the material cost, if you don't mind my asking? 

This is my understanding of how a skimmer works let me know just how right or wrong I may be.  Basicly water enters the main chamber and then air bubbles comming up from the bottom pick up the waste (I'm not sure if thats a properway to say it either) and bring it up to the collection chamber?  I think the smaller the bubbles the better (provides more surface area for the waste to collect on?

I'm trying to decide what will be the best path for me to take, so far I've narrowed it down to a sump under the tank with an in sump skimmer, or getting in touch with Adam and seeing his hang on refugium.  If I could build my own skimmer I'm sure it would make my choice a bit harder to make.

Back to Top
jfinch View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: March 06 2003
Location: Pleasant Grove
Status: Offline
Points: 7067
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 02 2003 at 3:05pm

1/4" cast acrylic will run about $3.50 - $4 per square foot (3/8" a little more).

6" tubing was about $8 per foot, 3 1/2" at about $4, 2" at about $2.

Call Regional Supply for exact pricing...

The potentially expensive item is the venturi.  I picked up mine used from one of the LFS for about $15, but they can run upwards of $25 - $50 (Kent Marine sells one (1/2") for about $20 that I would have used if I hadn't found mine).  If you're building a large skimmer, I'd use a Beckett Foam Head.  I bought one at Home Depot for $7.  Beckett skimmers need a big pump to function properly.

Yes, your understanding of skimmers is more or less accurate.  The difference in skimmers is how the air bubbles are created.  You can use an air pump and air stone, venturi, down draft nozzle, beckett head, venturi on the pump suction and paddle wheel on pump, ect.  The other, imo, important design consideration is contact time.

Why not build both!  I like using a skimmer but would really like to add a refugium to my system too!  Both projects require some woodworking tools to cut the material... anyone can glue .

If you don't have tools, I think Reginal Supply will cut for you.  If not I could cut out some pieces for you.  Good luck!

Back to Top
jfinch View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: March 06 2003
Location: Pleasant Grove
Status: Offline
Points: 7067
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 03 2003 at 5:28pm
Quote: Originally posted by maximus89 on 03 June 2003

 

  What kind of tools did you construct it with? What would be the most critical part of the whole project? Is that a beckkett injection? What am I looking in materials to build it? I have access to some 1/4 or 3/8 acrylic but nothing that is big enough to make a sump with but probably a skimmer box though! I found a site on reef.org online coarse 35.00 I think it was maco something like that Im to lazy to go back and find it anyway I was to late to sign up for it anyways it looked interesting though. But back to the skimmer I am fasinated about building a skimmer now and I cant get it off my mind if your getting that much foam off a 2100 then that is pretty effecient they dont draw that much elec. compared to most down draft injection models I have read about.  That ought to be a good start for me anyways


Tools:  You need some way to cut a straight line, I use a table saw, something to drill large holes for the riser tube, I use either a circle cutter in a drill press or a router with template, and something to drill smaller holes for inlet/outlet, I used a drill press.  If you plan to thread the acrylic, then you also need a tap.  If building a large skimmer, I'd just buy a couple bulkhead fittings and skip the threads.  Draw out what you think your skimmer should look like, figure the material needed and call one of the plastic suppliers to get prices.  I've probably got about $50 - $75 in mine, depending on whether you price new acrylic sheet or scrap from Regional Supply.

No my skimmer does not use a Beckett head, I would use one on a bigger skimmer though.  I do have plenty of bubbles and foam (it's almost solid white from bottom of riser to top), but mine is rather short.  I build mine as big as I could to fit in my stand, a longer primary riser would most likely work better.  I'm not really complaining... already it's perfoming more consistantly then my other one.

Back to Top
GonZo View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: July 26 2002
Location: Finland
Status: Offline
Points: 225
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GonZo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 03 2003 at 5:51pm

I see the tubes and all the bubbles but have no idea how it works or fits together. Do any of you have written designs (drawings, specs, etc) on how to build a skimmer and what the principles are to tweak the designs for increased efficiency? Links are ceartainly welcome.

Cortney (West Jordan)
The joy of discovery is certainly the liveliest that the mind of man can ever feel. - Claude Bernard
Back to Top
Jms021 View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: April 15 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 19
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jms021 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 03 2003 at 5:58pm

I would also be intrested in building one.

 

Back to Top
jfinch View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: March 06 2003
Location: Pleasant Grove
Status: Offline
Points: 7067
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 03 2003 at 8:16pm

Cortney,

Here's the same photo as above with explainations:

There are many different ways to make bubbles, what you see in this picture is a venturi nozzle.  IMO, what makes a good skimmer is lots of fine bubbles and lots of contact time.  Generating the bubbles are usually not a problem but the increased contact time means a longer/bigger skimmer.  Obviously, there must be compromises in the design.

Do a search from google for "protein skimmer", you'll get hundreds of hits.  Here's an old (but fairly good) site regarding design (also follow the links within the article):

http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/~cap/raid/skimmers/orig_dd/index.html

Back to Top
maximus89 View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: June 02 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maximus89 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 04 2003 at 9:35pm

 

  Looks good jon can tell you put a little time into the project seen the attachment also i have seen that before its on ozzy's reefs page. Do you know where I could get a beckket injector locally?I see there is no baffle or bubble trap in the skimmer box that isnt giving you any troubles no micros in your tank. I have alot that comes out of my skimmer its anoying as @### I assume you have seen the ones on my reef creations sponc on reef cen.. all of those you cant see in the skimmer box do you have inside secrets. He has some nice beccket head mods for sale i think there like 60 bucks or so though. Thanks in advance if I forget for all the answers

Quote:"A man has got to know his limitations"
Back to Top
jfinch View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: March 06 2003
Location: Pleasant Grove
Status: Offline
Points: 7067
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 04 2003 at 10:16pm
max,  wow I didn't know Ozzy was into reefs (sharon, where's the d%&# kalkwaser).  Try home depot or lowes for a beckett (or any other place that might sell pond supplies).  I got one last year at home depot.  The elbow inside the box performs the same function as a baffle... there are very few "nano" size bubbles that do make it through the skimmer.
Back to Top
maximus89 View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: June 02 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maximus89 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 13 2003 at 9:29am

 

    Its been a while I am still researching skimmer designs look at this one Jfinch I am going to make this kind of injectorhttp://http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=167257&highlight=cheapreef It looks like a good one and you can make it at home!

Quote:"A man has got to know his limitations"
Back to Top
maximus89 View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: June 02 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maximus89 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 13 2003 at 9:45am

 

  I cant get that link to work on my puter lets try it a again.http://http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=167257 I meant oz reef page sometimes I get a little disoriented I think yours is cool I am buying the materials this week I was wondering if that acrylic extruded comes in any thicker wall thickness? Do you think with the 1/4 inch glue seam is good enough? I want to build a quality skimmer but I cant afford the cast acrylic unless someone wants to go in on a 4' lenght with me? Thanks for all your help jfinch

Quote:"A man has got to know his limitations"
Back to Top
SSpargur View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: February 05 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1716
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SSpargur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 13 2003 at 10:05am

 

Jon, that looks great, nice job.

I personally paid quite a bit of money for my skimmer.  On the positive note, it works great!  On the negative side, I could of probably built an exact replica for $50.00.  LifeReef.com has a CAD design on their site.  They also sell their self cleaning venturi for around $15.00

Being new, I didn't want to build one.  Next time I think I'll DIY quite a bit of the stuff that I bought.

-Sean

Back to Top
jfinch View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: March 06 2003
Location: Pleasant Grove
Status: Offline
Points: 7067
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 13 2003 at 10:17am

maxiumus89,  you need to get rid of the extra http:// in you're linked address.  Here's the link:  http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=167257&highlight=cheapreef  This skimmer uses the same principle as the downdraft for air/water mixing and usually requires a larger pump... although he does seem to be getting good foam with just a Mag 7.

I didn't feel comfortable with 1/4", but you might .  That's why I used 3/8" material for the top and outlet side of the box.  The hole for the riser was cut to the outside diameter of the riser tube.  The riser tube was then slid into the top and glued giving a 3/8" glue line.  1/4" is problably fine, ymmv (abreviation for Marcus).

Give it a go with extruded.  My gut feeling is that it doesn't make much difference in the thinner material.  The problem with extruded (in water), as it was explained to me, is that it tends to absorb more water then cast causing it to swell and weakening the glue joints.  A 1/4" glue line is not going to move as much as a 1/2" (similar to the idea of cross grain gluing in woodworking).  The other problem with extruded is crazing (hundreds of micro cracks right at the glue line).  IME, extruded acrylic almost always crazes some... not sure it effects strength, but it doesn't do anything for asthetics. 

Back to Top
jfinch View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: March 06 2003
Location: Pleasant Grove
Status: Offline
Points: 7067
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 13 2003 at 10:27am
Quote: Originally posted by SSpargur on 13 June 2003

 

Jon, that looks great, nice job.

I personally paid quite a bit of money for my skimmer.  On the positive note, it works great!  On the negative side, I could of probably built an exact replica for $50.00.  LifeReef.com has a CAD design on their site.  They also sell their self cleaning venturi for around $15.00

Being new, I didn't want to build one.  Next time I think I'll DIY quite a bit of the stuff that I bought.

-Sean


Thanks Sean.  For me, building this sort of stuff is fun.  For other's I'm sure it's a pita!  You've got all the tools you'll ever need for working with acrylic... it's just clear wood .  BTW, the skimmer (and sump redesign) is doing great!
Back to Top
maximus89 View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: June 02 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maximus89 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 13 2003 at 11:26am

 

   Jon have you ever thought about laminating two .25 sheets together to get a .5 for the box I have alot of .25 or .375 scap I could laminate I would make it .75 wall if it would work and I dont see why it wouldnt do you?

Quote:"A man has got to know his limitations"
Back to Top
jfinch View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: March 06 2003
Location: Pleasant Grove
Status: Offline
Points: 7067
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 13 2003 at 12:47pm

Actually I have thought about that.  Gluing large panels together might prove difficult though.  3/4" is overkill, I'd say.

Back to Top
maximus89 View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
Avatar

Joined: June 02 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maximus89 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 13 2003 at 3:27pm

 

  I would agree on the over kill but I wanted to make a panel of 9"x7" if I laminated them together out of .25 or even .375 material what would I use for glue do you know? that would be the top of the skimmer box so I would have atleast .5 or .75 inch of glue joint. I could laminate the small sheets to gether and cut to size. I am asking you what glue or glues should I purchase I plan on buying the tubing and glue tomorrow at deviles. thanks for answering all my questions jon

Quote:"A man has got to know his limitations"
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.03
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.219 seconds.